To: World-Destiny@home.ease.lsoft.com
From: "Ernest P. Moyer" <epmoyer@netrax.net>
Subject: Judy's "Dream" Experiences
Judy Tuttle <lotus144@USA.NET>

This is in response to your two posts:  

Just Like the Earth Knows It Shall Rain Tomorrow...

Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 13:42:12 -0800


Scenario #2

Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 23:20:37 -0800  

For book-keeping purpose I shall reproduce your two posts.

These certainly were profound experiences, of such personal nature I am surprised that you dared to share them with us.

Obviously, you must trust us, and wish to extend a hand in mutual sharing.

I greatly respect you for that.

I also greatly respect you for contributing to our understanding. My visions are now more ennobled by your experience.

I find it simply amazing how things are unfolding.

If I have it correctly:

"Ubi caritas est vera, Deus ibi est." (Where affection is true, God is there.)

I will offer my thoughts.

I know that these experiences are very intimate, but in sharing with us, you helped all of us to understand. Therefore, I hope you will bear with me in my attempt to interpret the symbolic nature of your "dreams."

Apparent symbolisms are mixed.

I could say the stone slab was an examination table on board a seraphic craft. "Just finished" was the completion of their exam.

The clipped lock of hair (or clipped finger nails) has been reported often. (Used for genetic studies. Hair has been preserved for many thousands of years in mummified burials around our planet.)

The sores and burns may have been your mental transposition of examination marks.

The "high priest," taller than the others, could have been a supervisory entity.

I would understand the rituals as a dedication ceremony, even though highly symbolic.  

The soothing balm reflects the oil used in Old Testament times for dedication, and still practiced by the royalties of Europe when they crown their kings and queens. The immersion may have been an actual baptism, again representing your dedication.

I come now to an element which carries great significance for me.

You spoke about being nailed to a cross.

I know that crucifixions will take place. I do not know how widespread they will be. I had expected that there would be only one unique crucifixion, (see Rev 11:8), but your "communication" strongly suggests that such execution techniques may be more general.

Are any of us prepared to experience the agony Jesus experienced? If he led the way, and was the example, can we offer less?

Have you considered what an honor it would be to suffer the "sufferings of Christ" in our dedication to his call?

You said:

>I led them in song and a banquet was prepared. A >woman commented that this was, indeed a most unusual >ceremony. She, as well as the others had felt His >presence.

I don't know if you are aware of it but Moses and seventy of the elders of Israel were taken on board a seraphic transport where they had a banquet with "the God of Israel." See Exodus 24:9-11.

Adamski also reported being entertained in a banquet on board a seraphic transport at the termination of his "contact" episodes. Adamski discussed the feelings they all experienced about the presence of God, and now it affected each of them. See my web site where I compare these experiences.

I believe you also went through such an experience, but buried in your mind, and vented through your powerful "dream" episodes.

You had said to them:

>If a butterfly should alight upon the branch of a willow, I >don't know what that means."

I would suggest that you consider the emergence of the pupa from the cocoon. We are now the pupa. The cocoon is the protective covering which has held us all in safety until the time of release. The cocoon is just now beginning to open.

Do you remember where we illustrated the highly suggestive symbolism they use. They asked Betty Andreasson, "Do you have knowledge tried by fire?" That is a question which applies to all of us. Or, as the Revelators said to Sadler, (to paraphrase), "Are we ready for the trials and heartaches attendant upon a new Revelation."

The butterflies are about to alight on the branches.

The torn bit of silver paper with your birth date may have been their token of appreciation.

I shall not now discuss the second scenario. It seems to be a reinforcement for you.

I do know the serious problem of living in two worlds. Do you recall:


Forewarn all believers regarding the fringe of conflict which must be traversed by all who pass from the life as it is lived in the flesh to the higher life as it is lived in the spirit. To those who live quite wholly within either realm, there is little conflict or confusion, but all are doomed to experience more or less uncertainty during the times of transition between the two levels of living. In entering the kingdom, you cannot escape its responsibilities or avoid its obligations. But remember the gospel yoke is easy and the burden of truth is light.

You can see that we have an obligation, enlightened by our personal experiences:

"Forewarn all believers regarding the fringe of conflict . . ."


"Religious perplexities are inevitable; there can be no growth without psychic conflict and spiritual agitation."

This element will be a serious factor in our service to our brothers and sisters in the world.


"The progression of religious growth leads from stagnation through conflict to co-ordination, from insecurity to undoubting faith, from confusion of cosmic consciousness to unification of personality, from the temporal objective to the eternal, from the bondage of fear to the liberty of divine sonship."

God bless you, Judy.




These were Judy's two posts:


Just Like the Earth Knows It Shall Rain Tomorrow...

I have viewed my life within the Urantia community as that of a small piece of litmus paper.

Upon occasion, I have felt compelled to contribute, perhaps for no other reason, but to witness the response of the ";movers and shakers."; But, for the most part my role has been that of a ";lurker."; One whose sole function was to help determine those who truly love their fellow man, those who truly love Jesus.

"If you seek peace, you will find neither peace or truth but, if you
seek *truth* you will find truth and peace." Ernest, since early
childhood yours has been a dedication to the search for truth. Not only have you been so dedicated, but you have fully utilized all gifts that God has given to you in your relentless pursuit. You have withstood the crucible of time and this reason which has prompted me to send this post. "Ubi caritas est vera, Deus ibi est."

I have been an abductee for many, many years. Upon three occasions the event was corroborated with physical evidence. My husband, Tim, a very pragmatic man, is a tax attorney as well as a CPA and such a person has been necessary in my life in order to validate all that has ensued and shall soon be forthcoming. Well, Ernest, you asked for it:

It occurred during the month of August '81 or '82 while in a "sleep state" but, it is far more vivid than anything I have ever consciously experienced, far more vivid than this glassy faced monitor that sits before me. There has not been a waking day since, when I have failed to remember. I found myself naked, sitting at a stone table, as if "something" had just finished. Women were chanting incantations and tapping together small stones inscribe with symbols, hieroglyphics. I was given such a small rounded rock upon which a pictoglyph was painted, but I coud not interpret what was written. Frightened, I was shaking and perspiring. My body was covered with sores or burns. I was cold and offered a wrap. I was offered food and drink, but only accepted drink, because I was very thirsty and could not eat.

After I was more relaxed a very tall man, a priest wearing a white robe appeared to perform the ritual. He was significantly taller than the others. Although the priest had performed this ritual thousands of times, this was the first of this particular, unique nature. I was taken, disrobed, anointed with a soothing balm and immersed into a stone sarcophagus, which had been filled with soothing warm water. A lock of my hair was cut and kept by them.

I was then nailed upon a cross and suspended in the air. As the cross swung through the dark abyss I was frightened, so very, very afraid.

All that I could think to do was to cry out and keep repeating. "I love my Lord, Jesus. Oh, how I love my Lord, Jesus. I love Jesus." The most beautiful, mellifluous voice that one could imagine, so very, very beautiful answered, "I am here. I have always been here, within you."

It was the loving, reassuring voice of a parent for his small child,
the voice of the wind rustling through the tall grasses. Overcome with a profound sense of beauty and peace, I experienced the gentle mist of a beautiful April morning.

I then came down from the cross and was once again with the others. Given a white robe, they washed my feet and I signed some papers. They asked me what I learned and I told them that, "The end is very, very near." They were very sad and began to weep and I told them not to be sad, for this has been our purpose and what we have been preparing for so long. I led them in song and a banquet was prepared. A woman commented that this was, indeed a most unusual ceremony. She, as well as the others had felt His presence.

There were more rituals, the results of which were recorded in a large book, kept by the priest. I was given gifts and told that I would know how to use them when time necessitated.

I responded, "How will I know?"

"You will know. You will be given a sign."

"But, I don't understand your signs. If a butterfly should alight upon the branch of a willow, I don't know what that means."

"You will know. Just like the earth knows it shall rain tomorrow."

As they were ushering me out, we passed an antechamber where they administer to those who are dying. They said that when we die, they hover about us to comfort and console. "What you call people, we call time." They said that near the end, Tim would take me to a place where Mormons dwell. (This is the strange part which I now am experiencing.)

There is considerably more, which I shall forgo at this time. The clock struck 3 A.M. and I found myself with a pronounced THWACK, a strong jolt to the solar plexus back inside my body. As I was leaving them, I had clenched my fist, as I held hands with one. Upon my abrupt awakening, I found inside my hand a little piece of silver paper, torn as if from the inside of a gum or cigarette wrapper. Numerically imprinted upon the paper was the day, month and year of my birth. I immediately awakened Tim, a basic skeptic and he assured me that, yes, that was what was
written. Even to this day, I will ask if he had actually seen the tiny piece of paper and he strongly confirms the experience.


Scenario #2


Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 23:20:37 -0800

Scenario #2

March 23, 1996

A friend had phoned me long distance from Hawaii and said very little else, but to read pages 1257-1259 from the Urantia Book. Of course I was familiar with them, but decided to do so again at his request. As I reread the pages, what unfolded before me was an entire panorama of what would ensue by necessity, before such measures would be taken. I sobbed and sobbed, my body was writhing with emotion. I cried to myself, "No, no, no! Please don't let it happen!" After regaining my composure I decided to go downstairs. Upon descending the stair I froze midway, uncertain for how long. All that I could sense was the sound of the grandfather clock which echoed, "Time stops, tick tock, time stops." I was told that I could remain in the position that I was in , or if I would feel more comfortable I could go into the family room and lie down on the couch. I did so.

I found myself transported onto a gurney in the corridor of a large
ship. Those who were working around me were in a state of agitation and intense concern and kept saying, "Make way, make way! Fusion taking place. Make way!" A man who seemed to be in a position of higher authority asked what was happening. He was told that a fusion was taking place and that the subject had fully agreed. Before giving permission the subject had asked for validation. He took a look, gave a nod of approval and they proceeded. I felt as if a zipper from my neck
to my abdomen had been slowly opened and I was fully bathed in the most beautiful, radiant, golden light. I have no idea of how much time elapsed.

Upon awakening, I felt rested and was not convinced of the reality of my experience. The extraordinary experience was very profound, yet everything seemed ordinary in the house. Nothing had changed, kitty's dish was where it should be. The tea kettle was still on the stove. Nothing had change, nothing. Perhaps, I had experienced some strange delusion. Everything appeared normal. Nothing had changed. I was the very same person who lived in this house, who washed the dishes, who kept everything neat and tidy. Nothing had changed. I decided to go to the computer and reestablish myself with the "real" world. Waiting for me was this message:


Subj: Cosmic question

Date: 96-03-23 18:09:58 EST

From: DFordTX


If nothing changes......

Then does that mean that "Nothing" changes?

Dale in TX = DFORDTX@ aol.com

I wrote twice to the individual without response. I did an AOL search and only found that he was a married man living in Texas.